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02-28-2005, 04:21 AM

Your LAST bike? Hah! Anyone contemplating Carbon or Ti is someone
with at least a mild bike addiction! It won't be your last bike. I
bought an Independent Fab Crown Jewel Ti.... and two months later I HAD
to have a Bianchi Pista. Then, I saw a lovely hand-made steel touring
frame that I had to have.... the stable grows and occasionally you sell
one off... but bull**** your wife, not us.

Ok... so... now that we admit that we have a problem, we can go
forward.

I have to echo Goose somewhat. Why is the choice between Carbon and
Ti? If you're looking for a great quality bike, steel is definitely
not to be ruled out. I've owned carbon, steel, ti, and aluminum, and
I've liked the ride of the steel bikes the best. I still kick myself
for selling my Waterford back in grad school. Today, I've got a
bianchi steel bike, a Gios, and an Independent Fab Ti Crown Jewel. The
IF is fantastic... and will last forever.... but the 10 year old
bianchi eros rides just as nice.

The ride difference is this - the IF seems to flex a lot - but never in
the wrong direction. I can hammer the pedals without tourqing the rear
triangle - which happened on a waterford RS-11. My waterford made from
853 steel never did that. The Gios Lite is a pretty inexpensive steel
frame, but rides wonderfully.

I'm not a fan of carbon. I don't like the ride quality of what I have
sampled. I personally don't even like the carbon fork on my IF. I
really preferred the steel fork on my Waterford (oh I miss her) and the
steel fork on my Gios. Yes, the carbon is more damping of vibration
and almost acts as a suspension fork - but I prefer steel.

Are you looking at carbon and Ti from a weight perspective? My
philosophy is this - if you are concerned about weight, go get a
body-fat measurment taken. If you're a guy who is over 12% body fat,
then you have no excuse for buying a bike based on weight.

If you're looking at your *last* bike, or if you can even say that
knowing that it isn't true... then I presume that nobody is sponsoring
you. Meaning again, weight should not be a concern at all. An extra
two pounds on your bike can be lost by spending an extra two thousand
dollars, or it can be lost from your gut by riding harder.
Conventional Wisdom, for what it's worth, is that it costs $1000 to
take a pound off of a bike. So, given that I have at least ten pounds
of extra flab on my body that I could stand to lose, I've got ten grand
worth of exercising to do before I start caring about weight. (This is
not meant to slam you nor anyone else - just to help put the weight
consideration in some perspective).

Now... if weight is off the table... lets look at durability. Ti will
last beyond the extinction of mankind. You'll never see rust on ti.
Steel, if cared for, will last longer than you will live. Both can
take an impact, be repaired, and give a great ride.

Carbon -- there are great comments above about the sketchiness of
carbon. I dont know how long a carbon frame will last.

A consideration that might seem shallow, but I think is totally
legitimate is the "bike porn" value of whatever decision you make.
Part of what I love about cycling is the beauty of the machine. I dont
think there is anything wrong with lusting after Ti, a sweet steel
frame, or even carbon. Hey, there is nothing wrong with riding OCLV
"because it is what Lance rides." Don't be a fashion slave... but for
bike porn value, I'd say that it is a toss-up.

Now... think about this too. You say this is your "last bike."
(snicker.... snort... laugh). If so, you want it to fit perfectly -
don't you? There are some carbon manufacturers who will build you a
custom frame. Jack Kane comes to mind. There are a LOT of ti and
steel manufacturers who will do the same thing. Spend some money and
get a custom frame.

Bottom line... if it were me and I could have one last bike for the
rest of my life, I would check out Independent Fab's ti or steel, or
Waterford's steel, and get them custom-built.

Have fun on your "last bike!" (just one last beer... just one last bet
at the track.... at least your addiction is a healthy one!)

02-28-2005, 04:21 AM	#11 (permalink)
Velo Psycho Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Ti vs. Carbon Fiber Your LAST bike? Hah! Anyone contemplating Carbon or Ti is someone with at least a mild bike addiction! It won't be your last bike. I bought an Independent Fab Crown Jewel Ti.... and two months later I HAD to have a Bianchi Pista. Then, I saw a lovely hand-made steel touring frame that I had to have.... the stable grows and occasionally you sell one off... but bull**** your wife, not us. Ok... so... now that we admit that we have a problem, we can go forward. I have to echo Goose somewhat. Why is the choice between Carbon and Ti? If you're looking for a great quality bike, steel is definitely not to be ruled out. I've owned carbon, steel, ti, and aluminum, and I've liked the ride of the steel bikes the best. I still kick myself for selling my Waterford back in grad school. Today, I've got a bianchi steel bike, a Gios, and an Independent Fab Ti Crown Jewel. The IF is fantastic... and will last forever.... but the 10 year old bianchi eros rides just as nice. The ride difference is this - the IF seems to flex a lot - but never in the wrong direction. I can hammer the pedals without tourqing the rear triangle - which happened on a waterford RS-11. My waterford made from 853 steel never did that. The Gios Lite is a pretty inexpensive steel frame, but rides wonderfully. I'm not a fan of carbon. I don't like the ride quality of what I have sampled. I personally don't even like the carbon fork on my IF. I really preferred the steel fork on my Waterford (oh I miss her) and the steel fork on my Gios. Yes, the carbon is more damping of vibration and almost acts as a suspension fork - but I prefer steel. Are you looking at carbon and Ti from a weight perspective? My philosophy is this - if you are concerned about weight, go get a body-fat measurment taken. If you're a guy who is over 12% body fat, then you have no excuse for buying a bike based on weight. If you're looking at your last bike, or if you can even say that knowing that it isn't true... then I presume that nobody is sponsoring you. Meaning again, weight should not be a concern at all. An extra two pounds on your bike can be lost by spending an extra two thousand dollars, or it can be lost from your gut by riding harder. Conventional Wisdom, for what it's worth, is that it costs $1000 to take a pound off of a bike. So, given that I have at least ten pounds of extra flab on my body that I could stand to lose, I've got ten grand worth of exercising to do before I start caring about weight. (This is not meant to slam you nor anyone else - just to help put the weight consideration in some perspective). Now... if weight is off the table... lets look at durability. Ti will last beyond the extinction of mankind. You'll never see rust on ti. Steel, if cared for, will last longer than you will live. Both can take an impact, be repaired, and give a great ride. Carbon -- there are great comments above about the sketchiness of carbon. I dont know how long a carbon frame will last. A consideration that might seem shallow, but I think is totally legitimate is the "bike porn" value of whatever decision you make. Part of what I love about cycling is the beauty of the machine. I dont think there is anything wrong with lusting after Ti, a sweet steel frame, or even carbon. Hey, there is nothing wrong with riding OCLV "because it is what Lance rides." Don't be a fashion slave... but for bike porn value, I'd say that it is a toss-up. Now... think about this too. You say this is your "last bike." (snicker.... snort... laugh). If so, you want it to fit perfectly - don't you? There are some carbon manufacturers who will build you a custom frame. Jack Kane comes to mind. There are a LOT of ti and steel manufacturers who will do the same thing. Spend some money and get a custom frame. Bottom line... if it were me and I could have one last bike for the rest of my life, I would check out Independent Fab's ti or steel, or Waterford's steel, and get them custom-built. Have fun on your "last bike!" (just one last beer... just one last bet at the track.... at least your addiction is a healthy one!)