I forgot oblivious (Crash report) - Cycling Mob: Road Cycling, Mountain Biking and More

12-09-2003, 11:08 PM

So not too long ago I was ranting about *potential* accidents. This
week I get to report my first actual accident. whee.

So I'm heading home after work along Eastgate way (yes the same place
one of the previously mentioned incidents took place). I'm moving at
a decent pace, but I'm in no rush. I'm just enjoying a nice ride home
after a moderately long day of developing my cathode ray tube tan.

It's been raining today off and on, but it's clear out now. The sun
set about an hour ago, but traffic is unusually light. I'm all kitted
out with a 16 watt headlight, dual rear blinkies, nice hi-viz jacket,
etc. So I'm quite possibly the most visible thing on the street. I've
just passed the street right before Bank of America and am about to pass
their entrance. I notice someone stopped in the median waiting to turn
into the bank, he doesn't seem to be moving. I look at the entrance on
my right, someone is there, but I can see them looking at me, and they
seem to be stopped.

I'm about 10 yards from the entrance when the person to my left, who was
stopped in the median starts turning very quickly into the entrance. I
grab my brakes and try to turn left behind him. But there is not nearly
enough room left for this. I basically have time to scream "What are
you doing you stupid" *THUD*.

I slam into his front quarter panel, coming off my bike onto his hood.
My hip impacts the side of his car, I end up taking most of the impact
on my back as I slam into his windshield. I don't have quite enough
momentum to go over his hood. So I end up rolling off, back onto the
side my bike is lying. I get up fairly quickly and assess the damage
to myself. I don't seem to have broken anything and seem to be mostly
intact.

The fellow getting out of his car looks to be middle aged. He
basically said a lot of "Are you all right", "I'm sorry", etc. We ended
up pulling ourselves into the parking lot and gathering each other's
information. A kind soul gave me her name and phone number if I needed
a witness. The real irony is that guy who caused the accident works for
an insurance company and was driving a company car.

Oh and later I found out he said "I didn't see him". Bloody typical.

Examining my bike, the fork is *rather* bent, the wheel is moderately
tacoed. Bugger. I walk back to work carrying my bike. Eventually my
wife comes and picks me up and I go home to drown my sorrows in cold
theobromine rich substances.

I've heard back from the (third-party) insurance adjustor. Between my
account and the witnesses, they concede that I was entirely in the right.
I just got back my estimate from the shop. The bike is toast (fork,
front wheel, stem, handlebar, frame bent (Al)). The insurance company
is compensating me plus a bit, so it's time to get a new bike.

My old bike was a Giant OCR2, which served me reasonably well. I have
to admit I was planning on putting more than 12,000 miles on it. But
such will not be the case. My main points of dissatisfaction with it
were the short chainstays (preventing me using panniers), and the lack
of room for tires and room for fenders.

I'm looking at the Fuji Touring or possibly some cross bikes. Time to
hit the bike shops.

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
"No doubt Jack the Ripper excused himself on the grounds
that it was human nature." -A. A. Milne

12-10-2003, 12:03 AM

"Dane Jackson" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
news:uDzBb.2$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com...

> I slam into his front quarter panel, coming off my bike onto his hood.
> My hip impacts the side of his car, I end up taking most of the impact
> on my back as I slam into his windshield. I don't have quite enough
> momentum to go over his hood. So I end up rolling off, back onto the
> side my bike is lying. I get up fairly quickly and assess the damage
> to myself. I don't seem to have broken anything and seem to be mostly
> intact.

Police report.

Doctor's exam.

It's not (only) about the bike.

RichC

12-10-2003, 05:02 AM

In article <uDzBb.2$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com>, [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
says...
> So not too long ago I was ranting about *potential* accidents. This
> week I get to report my first actual accident. whee.
>
> So I'm heading home after work along Eastgate way (yes the same place
> one of the previously mentioned incidents took place). I'm moving at
> a decent pace, but I'm in no rush. I'm just enjoying a nice ride home
> after a moderately long day of developing my cathode ray tube tan.
>
> It's been raining today off and on, but it's clear out now. The sun
> set about an hour ago, but traffic is unusually light. I'm all kitted
> out with a 16 watt headlight, dual rear blinkies, nice hi-viz jacket,
> etc. So I'm quite possibly the most visible thing on the street. I've
> just passed the street right before Bank of America and am about to pass
> their entrance. I notice someone stopped in the median waiting to turn
> into the bank, he doesn't seem to be moving. I look at the entrance on
> my right, someone is there, but I can see them looking at me, and they
> seem to be stopped.
>
> I'm about 10 yards from the entrance when the person to my left, who was
> stopped in the median starts turning very quickly into the entrance. I
> grab my brakes and try to turn left behind him. But there is not nearly
> enough room left for this. I basically have time to scream "What are
> you doing you stupid" *THUD*.
>
> I slam into his front quarter panel, coming off my bike onto his hood.
> My hip impacts the side of his car, I end up taking most of the impact
> on my back as I slam into his windshield. I don't have quite enough
> momentum to go over his hood. So I end up rolling off, back onto the
> side my bike is lying. I get up fairly quickly and assess the damage
> to myself. I don't seem to have broken anything and seem to be mostly
> intact.

Glad to hear you're ok.

> The fellow getting out of his car looks to be middle aged. He
> basically said a lot of "Are you all right", "I'm sorry", etc. We ended
> up pulling ourselves into the parking lot and gathering each other's
> information. A kind soul gave me her name and phone number if I needed
> a witness. The real irony is that guy who caused the accident works for
> an insurance company and was driving a company car.
>
> Oh and later I found out he said "I didn't see him". Bloody typical.
>
> Examining my bike, the fork is *rather* bent, the wheel is moderately
> tacoed. Bugger. I walk back to work carrying my bike. Eventually my
> wife comes and picks me up and I go home to drown my sorrows in cold
> theobromine rich substances.
>
> I've heard back from the (third-party) insurance adjustor. Between my
> account and the witnesses, they concede that I was entirely in the right.
> I just got back my estimate from the shop. The bike is toast (fork,
> front wheel, stem, handlebar, frame bent (Al)). The insurance company

Bummer.

> is compensating me plus a bit, so it's time to get a new bike.

But not all bad news.

> My old bike was a Giant OCR2, which served me reasonably well. I have
> to admit I was planning on putting more than 12,000 miles on it. But
> such will not be the case. My main points of dissatisfaction with it
> were the short chainstays (preventing me using panniers), and the lack
> of room for tires and room for fenders.
>
> I'm looking at the Fuji Touring or possibly some cross bikes. Time to

I love my 2003 Fuji Touring. I prefer the maroon color of the 2003 to
the green of the 2004, though.

> hit the bike shops.

--
Dave Kerber
Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return address before replying!

REAL programmers write self-modifying code.

12-10-2003, 05:02 AM

"Rich Clark" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
news:[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]...
>
> "Dane Jackson" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
> news:uDzBb.2$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com...
>
> > I slam into his front quarter panel, coming off my bike onto his hood.
> > My hip impacts the side of his car, I end up taking most of the impact
> > on my back as I slam into his windshield. I don't have quite enough
> > momentum to go over his hood. So I end up rolling off, back onto the
> > side my bike is lying. I get up fairly quickly and assess the damage
> > to myself. I don't seem to have broken anything and seem to be mostly
> > intact.
>
> Police report.
>
> Doctor's exam.
>
> It's not (only) about the bike.
>
> RichC
>
Yeah really ... these things can haunt you for years, especially when you
get older. If your bike is toast, you must have done damage to yourself,
even if it only shows up later.

I hope you didn't sign anything yet ... why do you think the insurance
company was so eager to make you "happy"?

C.Q.C.

12-10-2003, 06:52 AM

>So not too long ago I was ranting about *potential* accidents. This
>week I get to report my first actual accident. whee.

From the title, I thought you had done something stupid to have your first
accident. But from the account, it was a boneheaded driver who apparantly
thinks bicycles and their riders are invisible.

If I were the insurance people for the other side, I would want a medical
release from you before a paid a penny. That is just reasonable. From your
side, I would strongly urge you to be sure that you have no injury from this
incident before you sign a release. As a suggestion, be sure that they pay
replacement value on a new equivilent bike to the one that was totalled and not
just the value of a used bike. A bike is cheap thrills and I think given that
you were probably injured, lost time, lost transport, were inconvenienced, that
you can with justification ask for a more then just replacelment value of you
old bike. You can say that you would consider an upgraded bike to compensate
you for all the bother.

12-10-2003, 07:09 AM

"Dane Jackson" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
news:uDzBb.2$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com...
> So not too long ago I was ranting about *potential* accidents. This
> week I get to report my first actual accident. whee.
>
> So I'm heading home after work along Eastgate way (yes the same place
> one of the previously mentioned incidents took place). I'm moving at
> a decent pace, but I'm in no rush. I'm just enjoying a nice ride home
> after a moderately long day of developing my cathode ray tube tan.
>
> It's been raining today off and on, but it's clear out now. The sun
> set about an hour ago, but traffic is unusually light. I'm all kitted
> out with a 16 watt headlight, dual rear blinkies, nice hi-viz jacket,
> etc. So I'm quite possibly the most visible thing on the street. I've
> just passed the street right before Bank of America and am about to pass
> their entrance. I notice someone stopped in the median waiting to turn
> into the bank, he doesn't seem to be moving. I look at the entrance on
> my right, someone is there, but I can see them looking at me, and they
> seem to be stopped.
>
> I'm about 10 yards from the entrance when the person to my left, who was
> stopped in the median starts turning very quickly into the entrance. I
> grab my brakes and try to turn left behind him. But there is not nearly
> enough room left for this. I basically have time to scream "What are
> you doing you stupid" *THUD*.
>
> I slam into his front quarter panel, coming off my bike onto his hood.
> My hip impacts the side of his car, I end up taking most of the impact
> on my back as I slam into his windshield. I don't have quite enough
> momentum to go over his hood. So I end up rolling off, back onto the
> side my bike is lying. I get up fairly quickly and assess the damage
> to myself. I don't seem to have broken anything and seem to be mostly
> intact.
>
> The fellow getting out of his car looks to be middle aged. He
> basically said a lot of "Are you all right", "I'm sorry", etc. We ended
> up pulling ourselves into the parking lot and gathering each other's
> information. A kind soul gave me her name and phone number if I needed
> a witness. The real irony is that guy who caused the accident works for
> an insurance company and was driving a company car.
>
> Oh and later I found out he said "I didn't see him". Bloody typical.
>
> Examining my bike, the fork is *rather* bent, the wheel is moderately
> tacoed. Bugger. I walk back to work carrying my bike. Eventually my
> wife comes and picks me up and I go home to drown my sorrows in cold
> theobromine rich substances.
>
> I've heard back from the (third-party) insurance adjustor. Between my
> account and the witnesses, they concede that I was entirely in the right.
> I just got back my estimate from the shop. The bike is toast (fork,
> front wheel, stem, handlebar, frame bent (Al)). The insurance company
> is compensating me plus a bit, so it's time to get a new bike.
>
> My old bike was a Giant OCR2, which served me reasonably well. I have
> to admit I was planning on putting more than 12,000 miles on it. But
> such will not be the case. My main points of dissatisfaction with it
> were the short chainstays (preventing me using panniers), and the lack
> of room for tires and room for fenders.
>
> I'm looking at the Fuji Touring or possibly some cross bikes. Time to
> hit the bike shops.
>
> --
> Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
> "No doubt Jack the Ripper excused himself on the grounds
> that it was human nature." -A. A. Milne

I've recounted my very similar incident here numerous times and, since some
folks seem to be offended by my retelling of it, I'll spare them.

My injuries were quite serious, but the worst of them didn't show up
initially and didn't cause me any problems initially -- a compression
fracture of the spine. It was 3 months later that pain began to set in at
the middle of my back and, only then did X-rays discover that fracture.

As others have already advised, don't assume you're OK and DON'T SIGN
ANYTHING! Get to the doctor and get checked out. And, be especially
careful of the waiver they (insurance company) try to give you when they
present you a check for the bike. A property settlement should be just
that -- for property only. If there's any language releasing them from
responsibility for any medical or other claims you might have, tell them to
stuff it. Tell them you'll take their check but you won't sign their
release. It worked for me. (It's customary that there's a property
settlement right away, then issues like medical, lost wages, pain and
suffering, etc. are settled down the road when they can be tallied.)

Glad you seem to be OK.

Bob C.

12-10-2003, 07:39 AM

Rich Clark <rdclark2SPAM@trapcomcast.net> wrote:

> "Dane Jackson" <dane@unseen.edu> wrote in message
> news:uDzBb.2$hc5.1@fe1.columbus.rr.com...

>> I slam into his front quarter panel, coming off my bike onto his hood.
>> My hip impacts the side of his car, I end up taking most of the impact
>> on my back as I slam into his windshield. I don't have quite enough
>> momentum to go over his hood. So I end up rolling off, back onto the
>> side my bike is lying. I get up fairly quickly and assess the damage
>> to myself. I don't seem to have broken anything and seem to be mostly
>> intact.

> Police report.

Should probably have done that.

> Doctor's exam.

Oh, I definitely did that. Exam, x-rays, the whole nine yards. My post
was just getting a wee bit long and I was getting ready for bed.

> It's not (only) about the bike.

Heresy!

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
Aphasia:
Loss of speech in social scientists when asked
at parties, "But of what use is your research?"

12-10-2003, 10:28 AM

archer <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:
> In article <uDzBb.2$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com>, [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
> says...

> Glad to hear you're ok.

Thanks.

>> is compensating me plus a bit, so it's time to get a new bike.

> But not all bad news.

True, though I would much rather be just riding my old one.

OTOH, I can stop feeling guilty about all the maintenance I had been
putting off.

>> I'm looking at the Fuji Touring or possibly some cross bikes. Time to

> I love my 2003 Fuji Touring. I prefer the maroon color of the 2003 to
> the green of the 2004, though.

That seems to be the consensus. I'm definitely going to try and test
ride some of those. I remember Recycled Cycles and a couple other
shops around Seattle carry them.

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
"Good generally conquers evil.
Unless, of course, good is stupid."

12-10-2003, 10:46 AM

Pbwalther <pbwalther@aol.com> wrote:
>>So not too long ago I was ranting about *potential* accidents. This
>>week I get to report my first actual accident. whee.

> From the title, I thought you had done something stupid to have your first
> accident. But from the account, it was a boneheaded driver who apparantly
> thinks bicycles and their riders are invisible.

It's actually a reference to my previous thread about car/bike
interactions. I really want to believe there was a way to avoid this
accident, but I can't think of much I could have done. Short of
traveling 5 MPH with road flares sticking out on every side.

Not that I haven't done stupid things on the bike (in and out of traffic)
, but not in a long while. I was being nice and alert, watching for
exactly this sort of thing. Bah.

> If I were the insurance people for the other side, I would want a medical
> release from you before a paid a penny. That is just reasonable. From your

Actually the bike damage and any injury claim are being handled totally
separately. So that's not too much of a concern.

> side, I would strongly urge you to be sure that you have no injury from this
> incident before you sign a release. As a suggestion, be sure that they pay
> replacement value on a new equivilent bike to the one that was totalled and not
> just the value of a used bike. A bike is cheap thrills and I think given that

I was already planning on being very adamant about that. Of course if
they want to compensate me for the time it would take to find an
equivalent used bike to the tune of my hourly wage I might be okay with
that.

> you were probably injured, lost time, lost transport, were inconvenienced, that
> you can with justification ask for a more then just replacelment value of you
> old bike. You can say that you would consider an upgraded bike to compensate
> you for all the bother.

I'm still in the process of talking to the adjustor. We'll see what
develops. So far they've been very cooperative and upfront. Hopefully
this continues, and we don't have yet another story about a cyclist who
was screwed by the insurance industry. <fingers crossed>

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
"No doubt Jack the Ripper excused himself on the grounds
that it was human nature." -A. A. Milne

12-10-2003, 11:00 AM

"Pbwalther" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
news:[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com...
> >So not too long ago I was ranting about *potential* accidents. This
> >week I get to report my first actual accident. whee.
>
> From the title, I thought you had done something stupid to have your first
> accident. But from the account, it was a boneheaded driver who apparantly
> thinks bicycles and their riders are invisible.
>
> If I were the insurance people for the other side, I would want a medical
> release from you before a paid a penny. That is just reasonable. From
your
> side, I would strongly urge you to be sure that you have no injury from
this
> incident before you sign a release. As a suggestion, be sure that they
pay
> replacement value on a new equivilent bike to the one that was totalled
and not
> just the value of a used bike. A bike is cheap thrills and I think given
that
> you were probably injured, lost time, lost transport, were inconvenienced,
that
> you can with justification ask for a more then just replacelment value of
you
> old bike. You can say that you would consider an upgraded bike to
compensate
> you for all the bother.

Further to this post, and from the voice of direct experience, you should
expect replacement value of the bike as an immediate "property settlement."
You should have your LBS give you a quote for the cost to replace the bike,
any clothing that was ruined, the helmet if it needs replacement, etc. My
insurance company accepted that without question and issued a check made out
to the penny.

Then, at the very minimum, your settlement for your pain and suffering,
inconvenience, etc. should be for AT LEAST triple your quantifiable
losses -- the replacement cost of your bike, plus your medical expenses,
plus any lost wages from work if you had to take time off to go to the doc,
etc. You should get three-times without any problem whatsoever. Depending
on the severity and whether or not there were witnesses, etc., you can get
as much as five times. Sometimes it takes a lawyers help to push that
envelope and, if you hire a lawyer, they're going to take a third. You
should be able to get three-times on your own by just being smart and acting
like you know what you're doing. That's a reasonable position and, if
they're reasonable, they'll take it and be glad to have the matter resolved.

Bob C.