Sag Wagon - Page 2 - Cycling Mob: Road Cycling, Mountain Biking and More

05-12-2004, 10:23 AM

MSA <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].uk> writed in
news:[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]:

> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>, jeverett3
> @earthlink.DEFEAT.UCE.BOTS.net says...
>> I just finished watching Stage 4 of the Giro, telecast live here in
>> the States on OLN (Outdoor Life Network). Phil Liggett, famous Brit
>> announcer, referred to the "sag wagon" which was trailing the field.
>>
>> We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the
>> origin of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common
>> British term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the
>> former, does anyone know the origin?
>>
>>
>> jeverett3<AT>earthlink<DOT>net [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
>>
>
> Yes, it is a well used term and not a Liggettism. Some believe it
> comes from the word sagging, I.e., sagging off the back. Others
> believe it is an acronym for Support And Gear. Take your pick :-)
>
I'm pretty sure it predates the term 'gear' (gear meaning 'stuff' or
equipment - which I think is a late '60s term)

05-12-2004, 10:51 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote:

>
>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Used enough in the U.S. and Britain to show up in some of my older
books, including some reprints of books from the 30s and 40s. Treating
it like an acronym was not very common until sometime in the later
60s. Earlier treated it like an ordinary word. In the first version of
Best of Bicycling (before that would be a satirical name for a book),
?Clifton Graves? uses it as a non-acronym. Was also used in some of
the Chas Messenger books IIRC, again as a non-acronym.

I personally never saw the 'Sag And Gear' breakout until Compuserve in
the early years, on the bicycle forum. At the time it was more like
someone trying to make up words to fit an acronym that wasn't.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

05-12-2004, 10:51 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote:

>
>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Used enough in the U.S. and Britain to show up in some of my older
books, including some reprints of books from the 30s and 40s. Treating
it like an acronym was not very common until sometime in the later
60s. Earlier treated it like an ordinary word. In the first version of
Best of Bicycling (before that would be a satirical name for a book),
?Clifton Graves? uses it as a non-acronym. Was also used in some of
the Chas Messenger books IIRC, again as a non-acronym.

I personally never saw the 'Sag And Gear' breakout until Compuserve in
the early years, on the bicycle forum. At the time it was more like
someone trying to make up words to fit an acronym that wasn't.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

05-12-2004, 10:51 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote:

>
>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Used enough in the U.S. and Britain to show up in some of my older
books, including some reprints of books from the 30s and 40s. Treating
it like an acronym was not very common until sometime in the later
60s. Earlier treated it like an ordinary word. In the first version of
Best of Bicycling (before that would be a satirical name for a book),
?Clifton Graves? uses it as a non-acronym. Was also used in some of
the Chas Messenger books IIRC, again as a non-acronym.

I personally never saw the 'Sag And Gear' breakout until Compuserve in
the early years, on the bicycle forum. At the time it was more like
someone trying to make up words to fit an acronym that wasn't.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

05-12-2004, 10:51 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote:

>
>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Used enough in the U.S. and Britain to show up in some of my older
books, including some reprints of books from the 30s and 40s. Treating
it like an acronym was not very common until sometime in the later
60s. Earlier treated it like an ordinary word. In the first version of
Best of Bicycling (before that would be a satirical name for a book),
?Clifton Graves? uses it as a non-acronym. Was also used in some of
the Chas Messenger books IIRC, again as a non-acronym.

I personally never saw the 'Sag And Gear' breakout until Compuserve in
the early years, on the bicycle forum. At the time it was more like
someone trying to make up words to fit an acronym that wasn't.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

05-12-2004, 10:51 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote:

>
>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Used enough in the U.S. and Britain to show up in some of my older
books, including some reprints of books from the 30s and 40s. Treating
it like an acronym was not very common until sometime in the later
60s. Earlier treated it like an ordinary word. In the first version of
Best of Bicycling (before that would be a satirical name for a book),
?Clifton Graves? uses it as a non-acronym. Was also used in some of
the Chas Messenger books IIRC, again as a non-acronym.

I personally never saw the 'Sag And Gear' breakout until Compuserve in
the early years, on the bicycle forum. At the time it was more like
someone trying to make up words to fit an acronym that wasn't.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

05-12-2004, 11:46 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote in message
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>:

>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Old-style cycling term, for sure. I am pretty confident, as the
others are, that "Support And Gear" (or the recursive Sag And Gear)
are backronyms; sag is less used now but certainly used to be in
common parlance for running out of steam, as in "sagging".

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

05-12-2004, 11:46 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote in message
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>:

>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Old-style cycling term, for sure. I am pretty confident, as the
others are, that "Support And Gear" (or the recursive Sag And Gear)
are backronyms; sag is less used now but certainly used to be in
common parlance for running out of steam, as in "sagging".

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

05-12-2004, 11:46 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote in message
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>:

>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Old-style cycling term, for sure. I am pretty confident, as the
others are, that "Support And Gear" (or the recursive Sag And Gear)
are backronyms; sag is less used now but certainly used to be in
common parlance for running out of steam, as in "sagging".

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

05-12-2004, 11:46 AM

On Wed, 12 May 2004 16:46:59 GMT, John Everett
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].BOTS.net> wrote in message
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>:

>We've had some debates on rec.bicycling.* over the years on the origin
>of the term, which is commonly used here. Is this a common British
>term or something Phil has picked up on his travels? If the former,
>does anyone know the origin?

Old-style cycling term, for sure. I am pretty confident, as the
others are, that "Support And Gear" (or the recursive Sag And Gear)
are backronyms; sag is less used now but certainly used to be in
common parlance for running out of steam, as in "sagging".

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University