is the landscape important when racing? - Page 2 - Cycling Mob: Road Cycling, Mountain Biking and More

05-28-2004, 04:11 PM

Tom Keats <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:
> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>,
> "madeleine" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> > Why is the tour de france so famous?

> 1) American media
> 2) American winners
> 3) it's easier for anglophones (esp. bettors in Las
> Vegas) to figure out how to pronounce, than 'Giro
> d'Italia' or 'Vuelta d'Espana'

> The Kentucky Derby is more famous than the Belmont or
> Preakness, too. I guess the name: 'Kentucky Derby'
> just has more cachet.

> What I wanna know is, why isn't the UCI XC or DH
> World Cup so famous?? But I think I know the answer:

> 1) no[t much] American media
> 2) apathy about American winners
> 3) it's not football, baseball, or that girls' game
> (basketball)
> 4) cycling isn't so appreciated in the United States

> Anyhow, there's an whole world beyond the limited
> horizons of American sports media.

I have a vague feeling the original post was a troll,
but Tom, your response is remarkably American-centric.
The Tour is the most famous of the three grand Tours in
Europe, among Europeans, regardless of what the US knows.

It's the oldest, biggest, most international (more
non-French Tour winners than non-Italian Giro winners, etc),
has the most tradition, and so on. Unlike the Giro and
Vuelta, the Tour also takes place in the summer when Europeans
can go on vacation to camp out and watch it - I think this has
increased a lot in the past few decades.

World Cup mountain bike racing hasn't been around for very long
and is a UCI structure imposed upon a grass-roots cycling
movement (the popularization of "mountain biking" as such
since the early 80s or so). It's not surprising to me that
the mix of UCI fogies and gnarly mountain bikers (much less
freerider dudes) doesn't always gel.

05-28-2004, 04:22 PM

In article <40b7c719$1@darkstar>,
Benjamin Weiner <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> I have a vague feeling the original post was a troll,
> but Tom, your response is remarkably American-centric.
> The Tour is the most famous of the three grand Tours in
> Europe, among Europeans, regardless of what the US knows.

When I read:
> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>,
> "madeleine" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> > Why is the tour de france so famous?

I thought in terms of world-wide fame.

American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
participate in the race.

Without American participation, there wouldn't be as much
media coverage, and therefore there'd be less recognition
of it around the world.

Without American media interest, not many people in the world
are even aware of Papua New Guinea inter-tribal cricket (which
I imagine would get quite boring after the first several days.)

Of course, to attract American media interest to the TdF, there
has to be American participation. American winners keep the
attention happening.

So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
wrong with that. That's just how it is.

I /do/ have a pet peeve about people whose sole interest in
sports events derives from speculation/gambling. But I'm
sure many Americans as well as other people around the world
feel the same way.

> World Cup mountain bike racing hasn't been around for very long
> and is a UCI structure imposed upon a grass-roots cycling
> movement (the popularization of "mountain biking" as such
> since the early 80s or so). It's not surprising to me that
> the mix of UCI fogies and gnarly mountain bikers (much less
^^^^^^^^^^
Heh. I like it :-)

> freerider dudes) doesn't always gel.

Anyhow, I still think of basketball as a girls' game.
I guess I'm a fogie too.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

05-28-2004, 04:22 PM

In article <40b7c719$1@darkstar>,
Benjamin Weiner <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> I have a vague feeling the original post was a troll,
> but Tom, your response is remarkably American-centric.
> The Tour is the most famous of the three grand Tours in
> Europe, among Europeans, regardless of what the US knows.

When I read:
> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>,
> "madeleine" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> > Why is the tour de france so famous?

I thought in terms of world-wide fame.

American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
participate in the race.

Without American participation, there wouldn't be as much
media coverage, and therefore there'd be less recognition
of it around the world.

Without American media interest, not many people in the world
are even aware of Papua New Guinea inter-tribal cricket (which
I imagine would get quite boring after the first several days.)

Of course, to attract American media interest to the TdF, there
has to be American participation. American winners keep the
attention happening.

So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
wrong with that. That's just how it is.

I /do/ have a pet peeve about people whose sole interest in
sports events derives from speculation/gambling. But I'm
sure many Americans as well as other people around the world
feel the same way.

> World Cup mountain bike racing hasn't been around for very long
> and is a UCI structure imposed upon a grass-roots cycling
> movement (the popularization of "mountain biking" as such
> since the early 80s or so). It's not surprising to me that
> the mix of UCI fogies and gnarly mountain bikers (much less
^^^^^^^^^^
Heh. I like it :-)

> freerider dudes) doesn't always gel.

Anyhow, I still think of basketball as a girls' game.
I guess I'm a fogie too.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

05-28-2004, 04:22 PM

In article <40b7c719$1@darkstar>,
Benjamin Weiner <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> I have a vague feeling the original post was a troll,
> but Tom, your response is remarkably American-centric.
> The Tour is the most famous of the three grand Tours in
> Europe, among Europeans, regardless of what the US knows.

When I read:
> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>,
> "madeleine" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> > Why is the tour de france so famous?

I thought in terms of world-wide fame.

American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
participate in the race.

Without American participation, there wouldn't be as much
media coverage, and therefore there'd be less recognition
of it around the world.

Without American media interest, not many people in the world
are even aware of Papua New Guinea inter-tribal cricket (which
I imagine would get quite boring after the first several days.)

Of course, to attract American media interest to the TdF, there
has to be American participation. American winners keep the
attention happening.

So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
wrong with that. That's just how it is.

I /do/ have a pet peeve about people whose sole interest in
sports events derives from speculation/gambling. But I'm
sure many Americans as well as other people around the world
feel the same way.

> World Cup mountain bike racing hasn't been around for very long
> and is a UCI structure imposed upon a grass-roots cycling
> movement (the popularization of "mountain biking" as such
> since the early 80s or so). It's not surprising to me that
> the mix of UCI fogies and gnarly mountain bikers (much less
^^^^^^^^^^
Heh. I like it :-)

> freerider dudes) doesn't always gel.

Anyhow, I still think of basketball as a girls' game.
I guess I'm a fogie too.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

05-28-2004, 04:22 PM

In article <40b7c719$1@darkstar>,
Benjamin Weiner <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> I have a vague feeling the original post was a troll,
> but Tom, your response is remarkably American-centric.
> The Tour is the most famous of the three grand Tours in
> Europe, among Europeans, regardless of what the US knows.

When I read:
> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>,
> "madeleine" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> > Why is the tour de france so famous?

I thought in terms of world-wide fame.

American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
participate in the race.

Without American participation, there wouldn't be as much
media coverage, and therefore there'd be less recognition
of it around the world.

Without American media interest, not many people in the world
are even aware of Papua New Guinea inter-tribal cricket (which
I imagine would get quite boring after the first several days.)

Of course, to attract American media interest to the TdF, there
has to be American participation. American winners keep the
attention happening.

So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
wrong with that. That's just how it is.

I /do/ have a pet peeve about people whose sole interest in
sports events derives from speculation/gambling. But I'm
sure many Americans as well as other people around the world
feel the same way.

> World Cup mountain bike racing hasn't been around for very long
> and is a UCI structure imposed upon a grass-roots cycling
> movement (the popularization of "mountain biking" as such
> since the early 80s or so). It's not surprising to me that
> the mix of UCI fogies and gnarly mountain bikers (much less
^^^^^^^^^^
Heh. I like it :-)

> freerider dudes) doesn't always gel.

Anyhow, I still think of basketball as a girls' game.
I guess I'm a fogie too.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

05-28-2004, 04:22 PM

In article <40b7c719$1@darkstar>,
Benjamin Weiner <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> I have a vague feeling the original post was a troll,
> but Tom, your response is remarkably American-centric.
> The Tour is the most famous of the three grand Tours in
> Europe, among Europeans, regardless of what the US knows.

When I read:
> In article <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]>,
> "madeleine" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> writes:

> > Why is the tour de france so famous?

I thought in terms of world-wide fame.

American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
participate in the race.

Without American participation, there wouldn't be as much
media coverage, and therefore there'd be less recognition
of it around the world.

Without American media interest, not many people in the world
are even aware of Papua New Guinea inter-tribal cricket (which
I imagine would get quite boring after the first several days.)

Of course, to attract American media interest to the TdF, there
has to be American participation. American winners keep the
attention happening.

So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
wrong with that. That's just how it is.

I /do/ have a pet peeve about people whose sole interest in
sports events derives from speculation/gambling. But I'm
sure many Americans as well as other people around the world
feel the same way.

> World Cup mountain bike racing hasn't been around for very long
> and is a UCI structure imposed upon a grass-roots cycling
> movement (the popularization of "mountain biking" as such
> since the early 80s or so). It's not surprising to me that
> the mix of UCI fogies and gnarly mountain bikers (much less
^^^^^^^^^^
Heh. I like it :-)

> freerider dudes) doesn't always gel.

Anyhow, I still think of basketball as a girls' game.
I guess I'm a fogie too.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

05-29-2004, 07:38 AM

>American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
>significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
>the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
>World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
>participate in the race.

The TdF has been getting massive coverage long before the American media became
interested in it due to Lance. Honest :-) There's an entire world outside of
the USA you know ;-)

snippity...

>So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
>saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
>wrong with that. That's just how it is.

It makes the race more notable to *Americans* - there's been *millions* of
non-Americans following the TdF for an awful long time, even if a few on
t'other side of the pond haven't been aware of this ;-)

Cheers, helen s

--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
h*$el*$$e*nd**$o$ts**i*$*$m*m$o*n*s@$*a$o*l.c**$om $

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--

05-29-2004, 07:38 AM

>American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
>significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
>the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
>World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
>participate in the race.

The TdF has been getting massive coverage long before the American media became
interested in it due to Lance. Honest :-) There's an entire world outside of
the USA you know ;-)

snippity...

>So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
>saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
>wrong with that. That's just how it is.

It makes the race more notable to *Americans* - there's been *millions* of
non-Americans following the TdF for an awful long time, even if a few on
t'other side of the pond haven't been aware of this ;-)

Cheers, helen s

--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
h*$el*$$e*nd**$o$ts**i*$*$m*m$o*n*s@$*a$o*l.c**$om $

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--

05-29-2004, 07:38 AM

>American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
>significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
>the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
>World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
>participate in the race.

The TdF has been getting massive coverage long before the American media became
interested in it due to Lance. Honest :-) There's an entire world outside of
the USA you know ;-)

snippity...

>So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
>saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
>wrong with that. That's just how it is.

It makes the race more notable to *Americans* - there's been *millions* of
non-Americans following the TdF for an awful long time, even if a few on
t'other side of the pond haven't been aware of this ;-)

Cheers, helen s

--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
h*$el*$$e*nd**$o$ts**i*$*$m*m$o*n*s@$*a$o*l.c**$om $

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--

05-29-2004, 07:38 AM

>American media is so globally pervasive, it must play a
>significant role in giving recognition to the TdF throughout
>the world, even in exotic little non-New World and non-Old
>World countries (like maybe Papua New Guinea?) that don't
>participate in the race.

The TdF has been getting massive coverage long before the American media became
interested in it due to Lance. Honest :-) There's an entire world outside of
the USA you know ;-)

snippity...

>So I'm not slaggin' on Americans or anything like that. I'm just
>saying their involvement makes the race more notable. Nuthin'
>wrong with that. That's just how it is.

It makes the race more notable to *Americans* - there's been *millions* of
non-Americans following the TdF for an awful long time, even if a few on
t'other side of the pond haven't been aware of this ;-)

Cheers, helen s

--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
h*$el*$$e*nd**$o$ts**i*$*$m*m$o*n*s@$*a$o*l.c**$om $

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--