Threaded versus threadless headset - Page 2 - Cycling Mob: Road Cycling, Mountain Biking and More

08-20-2003, 12:35 PM

Everyone is riding threadless??
And those that do ride with quill stems are the "lamers" in the "B" group
with 32 spoke wheels??

I own 7 bikes, including racing, touring, and track. Not one of them takes a
threadless headset.

In our local cycling haven, where on any given ride I encounter dozens of
cyclists every day, including several clubs and a couple racing teams, I
have never been dropped by another rider or group. Except once, and that guy
who dropped me did it on a lugged steel mid 80's Pinarello with a quill stem
and 32 spoke wheels.

On the other hand, I frequently will come upon riders with the latest carbon
fiber or titanium and aero wheeled wizardry, catch them, pass them, and drop
them. Sometimes they'll try to hang on for a while, but then drop back
wheezing for air when we hit the hills. If they aren't that good of a rider,
the bike isn't helping them. "It's not the bike -- it's the rider" is a
tired cliche -- but it's true nonetheless.

Anybody who thinks that a threadless headset can make them faster needs a
reality check.

"Fabrizio Mazzoleni" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
news:UwN0b.819184$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]. ca...
>
> David L. Johnson wrote in message ...
> >>
> >With a quill stem (that is, with a threaded fork and headset),
>
> Dave, when was the last time you saw anyone
> riding with those old things, these days
> everyone ride threadless.
>
> And if you do see guys with quill stems on the
> next ride then find another group to ride with,
> because they are the 'B' group. Those are
> probably the same lamers that are running
> conventional 32 spoke wheels. Not the types
> you want to been seen with!
>
>
>

08-20-2003, 12:50 PM

"Kyle Brooks" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message
news:FYQ0b.3107$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].atl.earthlin k.net...
> Everyone is riding threadless??
> And those that do ride with quill stems are the "lamers" in the "B" group
> with 32 spoke wheels??
>
> I own 7 bikes, including racing, touring, and track. Not one of them takes
a
> threadless headset.
>
> In our local cycling haven, where on any given ride I encounter dozens of
> cyclists every day, including several clubs and a couple racing teams, I
> have never been dropped by another rider or group. Except once, and that
guy
> who dropped me did it on a lugged steel mid 80's Pinarello with a quill
stem
> and 32 spoke wheels.
>
> On the other hand, I frequently will come upon riders with the latest
carbon
> fiber or titanium and aero wheeled wizardry, catch them, pass them, and
drop
> them. Sometimes they'll try to hang on for a while, but then drop back
> wheezing for air when we hit the hills. If they aren't that good of a
rider,
> the bike isn't helping them. "It's not the bike -- it's the rider" is a
> tired cliche -- but it's true nonetheless.

EVERYbody knows that it isn't the guys on the fancy new bikes ya gotta watch
out for, its the guys on the beat up POS bikes that'll kick your arse! They
actually RIDE their bikes! (not do what I do and hang them in the garage and
clean off imaginary dirt.)

Mike

>
> Anybody who thinks that a threadless headset can make them faster needs a
> reality check.
>

Of course it'll make you faster. Why else would you buy one?

Riding faster is just about as much mental as it is physical.

Mike

08-20-2003, 12:53 PM

"Threadless headset" is a lame name for an improvement that had such a
long time to market. The quill stem, aka, the creaking, wobbling,
permanently stuck stem, was always a weak part on the bicycle that has
been relieved of duty by this innovation. The main feature is not the
headset with its lack of threads, but the stem and its solid reliable
and removable attachment to the steer tube. However, the head bearing
can be adjusted in a trifle, without two ungainly 8-point end
wrenches. The whole job can be done with an Allen wrench. Besides
that, for the weight weenies, it's lighter.

For safety and reliability, get a stem that has two screws on the
steer tube end and four on the front plate so that a one screw failure
will not let the handlebar go free.

Jobst Brandt
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
Palo Alto CA

08-20-2003, 12:59 PM

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 16:57:45 -0400, Rick Onanian <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:14:14 GMT, Bob M <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com> wrote:
>>> Which bearings, and what type of adjustment?
>>
>> Basically, you tighten the bolt on the cap until you feel no play in the
>> headset (which can be done by grabbing the front brakes and pushing the
>> bike forward). That's the adjustment. On a threaded headset, it's the
>
> The bolt in the cap is functional beyond holding
> the cap on?
>
> Okay, well, I bolted the cap pretty tight anyway,
> and haven't noticed any play. I'll check
> sometime soon.
>

Once the cap is used to tighten the headset and the stem is tightened, then
you can remove the cap, as it serves no purpose. I wouldn't remove the
cap, as I'd lose it, but you can.

--
Bob M in CT
Remove 'x.' to reply

08-20-2003, 01:04 PM

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:50:02 -0700, Mike S. <mikeshaw2@coxDOTnet> wrote:
> Riding faster is just about as much mental as it is physical.

I'd say significantly more.

That's why an exciting bike with aero-this and
carbon fiber that and high tech something else
is better; you _want_ to ride it, and are rewarded
for riding it more by getting in better shape...for
an overall effect of faster speed.

People not excited by bright colors and gimmickry
are the guys on an old, beat up mountain bike with
a milk crate (complete with dog) and flat pedals
with work boots who fly past the rest of us without
breathing hard. They also tend to be wearing jeans
and a dress shirt.

Okay, I haven't actually seen such a person, but I
recall a post here by somebody claiming to be such
a person.

> Mike
--
Rick Onanian

08-20-2003, 01:06 PM

"Hjalmar Duklæt" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote in message news:<rgI0b.15384$[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].no>...
> Hi,
> What's the advantage of a threadless headset over an oldfashioned threaded
> one? Is the threaded one stiffer/lighter? Would it improve my riding in any
> way going from threaded to threadless?
> Hjalmar

As Peter Cole mentioned, a threadless stem won't get corroded stuck.
If you've never had a threaded stem get stuck because of sweat
dripping into the gap, then that advantage probably won't mean much to
you.

A drawback to the threaded design that hasn't been mentioned is that
you can break the steerer if you're not careful in getting the wedge
below the threaded area.

08-20-2003, 01:25 PM

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 16:28:41 -0400, David L. Johnson
<[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:
> Yes, it's simple enough to re-adjust, though I do not like the idea of
> trying to adjust the preload if the bearings are not clean and well-
> lubed.

Okay, now I'm a bit afraid again. I've never heard
of the term "preload" applied to anything other
than suspension.

What is "preload" in this context, and how should I
check / adjust it?

Like I said, I've changed stems a couple times on
my threadless road bike, and haven't noticed any
looseness or maladjustment from it...and have had
my longest and fastest ride ever just a few days
ago.

--
Rick Onanian

08-20-2003, 01:32 PM

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 17:25:49 -0400, Rick Onanian <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 16:28:41 -0400, David L. Johnson
> <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:
>> Yes, it's simple enough to re-adjust, though I do not like the idea of
>> trying to adjust the preload if the bearings are not clean and well-
>> lubed.
>
> Okay, now I'm a bit afraid again. I've never heard
> of the term "preload" applied to anything other
> than suspension.
>
> What is "preload" in this context, and how should I
> check / adjust it?
>
> Like I said, I've changed stems a couple times on
> my threadless road bike, and haven't noticed any
> looseness or maladjustment from it...and have had
> my longest and fastest ride ever just a few days
> ago.
>

Preload, I think, is just the "load" put on the bearings when you tighten
the bolt in the cap. If you want to know for sure what's going on, take
apart your bike. It's easy to do and will show you how everything works.
I built my mountain bike from the ground up (ordered the frame, the parts,
the wheels, etc.). It's not hard to do.

--
Bob M in CT
Remove 'x.' to reply

08-20-2003, 01:43 PM

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 21:32:17 GMT, Bob M <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ].com> wrote:
> Preload, I think, is just the "load" put on the bearings when you tighten

Good. I tightened it nicely every time.

> the bolt in the cap. If you want to know for sure what's going on, take
> apart your bike. It's easy to do and will show you how everything works.

I have quite the collection of beaters I can experiment
on, lately. I should do that. Heck, I even have a birthday
coming up; maybe I'll ask for a tool kit.

> I built my mountain bike from the ground up (ordered the frame, the
> parts, the wheels, etc.). It's not hard to do.

I'd like to do that sometime...I just lack the money.

--
Rick Onanian

08-20-2003, 01:51 PM

"Hjalmar Duklæt" <[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]> wrote:

> What's the advantage of a threadless headset over an oldfashioned threaded
> one? Is the threaded one stiffer/lighter?

Threadless systems are significantly stiffer, sometimes lighter, and
less likely to suffer structural failure than quill stem systems, for
any given materials and tolerances. This is primarily due to the
categorical superiority of an external binder clamp vs. an internal
expander wedge, but also due to the weakening effect of steerer
threads.

The other advantage of threadless headset systems is that the steerer
tube wall thickness is not dictated by the assembly, allowing the use
of materials besides steel (or the use of different thicknesses of
steel).

There is a cost benefit of threadless forks to manufacturers and
distributors, because all sizes of frames may be accommodated with a
single type of fork. Note however that the cheapest mass-market
bikes, which were only ever offered in one size, have retained quill
stems and threaded headsets.

> Would it improve my riding in any
> way going from threaded to threadless?

Not noticeably. If your bike is already set up, there is no
compelling reason to swap systems unless you must replace your fork.

Chalo Colina